syd's "lunacy" and Jugbandblues

[stardiamond]

Does anyone here know the time-line of syd's illness set against his writing?
For instance, a song like Jugbandblues has lyrics that questions
a lot of things of Syd himself and Syd contra the band.
Yet when was Jugbandblues written? If it was written before he
got into trouble with the band, than it can't be about the band.
If it was written in the early stages of his illness, when he was
still seen as just another musician on LSD, then it can't be seen
as a selfdiagnosis either because noone knew he was sick untill
people began to suspect him of being mentally ill.
I come to this question because Syd Barrett got out of controll
after the Piper at the gates of Dawn-sessions. I heard that Jug-
band (correct me if I'm wrong cause I'm not sure) and Remember
a Day were songs left over from those sessions. If that's the case
then how can Syd record a selfdiagnosing song about him loosing
grip over his own self, when that period was just beginning.
I assume when your illness begins, you don't see inmediatly what's wrong with you.
Please respond and correct me if I'm wrong in some of the above.

[DeathTöngue]

Here's a short answer : http://www.pinkfloydfan.net/showthre...&threadid=1403

There's much more.

[stardiamond]

In december 1967 Jugbandblues was recorded. Syd was to become the "Brian Wilson" of Pink Floyd. Yes he had problems
with his health, but a lot of tensions inside the band were also
building up.
Who didn't hear the story about the rest of the band
saying before leaving for a concert: "shall we pick him up? no,
leave him at home, let's try it by ourselves".
Roger Waters said on several occaisions that the band wanted
success, like any other band. Syd grew tired of creating 'hit-records". So this was at odds with what the others had planned.
OK, Syd was not well, however he wasn't an overnight/instant 'vedgetableman' either.
So he grew aware of the discontent of the other bandmembers and in my view put them down with Jugbandblues.
Another song that proves this is "Have you got it yet?"
During the recording/rehearsal session
the band couldn't follow Barrett's ever changing rythem and melody,
after each stop, he mocked them by the singing the title
back to them...."have you got it yet?" "No", the band had to reply.

In Jugbandblues there's proof of that too.
Think of the line "..you brought me here...(sounds as being forced
to be here cause he was brought...so he didn't come in his own
free will-he had to write hit-records remember?)
he has to be gratefull ("considerate, obliged') that he's allowed to write this song, and that others trew away his old shoes...
But later he mock's his mates saying "I'm wondering WHO could be writing this song" as if he's saying I am doing it because the rest of the band can't write.
He underlines this at the end by saying can you imagine anything? with the lines: and what exactly is a dream, and what exactly is a joke?
Yes Syd say's things in a strange way trough his lyrics and in
a rare interview. However like a lot of Captain Beefheart lyrics
it becomes much clearer when one reads them again and again.
Iff only Syd's illness was playing a part during his departure, then
Jugbandblues would have had other lines. But most of the lyric
show that there was a tension between him and the band.

Remember that when Dave Gilmour took his position in the band
Syd Barrett turned up at concerts, looking up from the audience,
as giving the message, "remember, this is MY band".

Proof that Jugbandblues is about Syd's schyzofrenic mind
is not very strong.
However this is different with the song "Vedgetable Man". Yet its such an overt song about being a person
with a schyzofrenic character, its almost a caricature.
Even here Syd seems to mock people who think he's a nutter
by saying I'm a Vedgetableman, so what?
The sad thing that strikes me in the song is the line:
"I've been looking all over the place for a place for me but
it ain't anywhere...." Syd is not crazy here.. he's ****ing real.
He saying really...is this the world that we really want to live in?
Maybe that's the reason why he escaped in the universe of his
own mind.

[Ebony Totem]

Jugband Blues is from A Saucerful of Secrets http://www.pinkfloydfan.net/t1508.html

Somewhere in the Interviews section David Gilmour talks about what it was like to produce Barrett's two solo albums. That is good reading for insights into his state of mind. After his illness became apparent people noticed songs that seemed to point out his mental state, songs like'Opel' and 'Wouldn't You Miss Me?' from Opel and 'Waving My Arms in the Air' from his album, Barrett.

It might be hard to separate the effects of the drugs he took from his mental deterioration, though. I think some who knew him would rather believe it was all drugs rather than mental disease and some would rather not have it discussed at all. I don't think we will ever really know since those who lived it with him haven't ever cashed in on their memories. And isn't that a lovely testimony for him?

[doctor_how]

Sorry, but some Beefheart lyrics just don't make sense, period. Neon Meate Dream of an Octafish? c'mon....

[Botley]

The sad truth is that Syd probably knew exactly what was happening to him. In all likelyhood he had "good days" when he could write music like JB that reflected upon his situation with perfect lucidity and insight even as he descended further into madness.

[Lumiere]

Originally posted by Ebony Totem
[b]Jugband Blues is from A Saucerful of Secrets http://www.pinkfloydfan.net/t1508.html

yes. we know. We were just speculating whether it was recorded during the piper sessions and then left off the album.

[Craig Marion]

[Botley]

For complete information on ALL pink floyd sessions from 1967-8:

http://www.sydbarrett.net/subpages/m...pfsessions.htm

[waters]

Wow! That is a waaay kool link.

[Lumiere]

Thanks for the link, old chap.